Race Report. SRC Round 7 SSME

[stoo23]

Hey Darryl, thanks for 'chiming-in' and providing an explanation

Like I said, I too was and would have been completely Unaware of the tyre Width Rule !! (as mentioned in reference to what we often ran at Raceworld,.. WITH Richard)

I can also understand your 'Choice' as such As Scrutineer and also Applaud Richard for His 'Attitude' as well and agree with Your sentiments regarding being of the 'Right Stuff' etc ,.. it IS after all about simply Having FUN and racing with friends etc

Personally, I think it VERY Interesting that he managed Such a Performance With Narrow HARD Tyres !!!,.. Kinda' makes one Think !!
Who knows, maybe the car may Not have been AS Fast With Wider Tyres !!??,.. Maybe, EVEN Faster !!,.. lol

Can only surmise the traction 'On the Night', Must have been pretty good though.

[brady]

Hello Gents.James made this rule for a reason.I know because I spoke to him about it when he did it.If he wants to explain it its up to him.Show me a set of nationally unified rules for GT1 cars.Its all up to the individual tracks running the Nats man,so its up to the track owners to make the rules they see fit.And I CANT beleive somebody wasnt willing to throw Richard a set of tires to make him legal.Check The Rules For Any Track You Go To.Even the Body rule James made probably is not enforced at other tracks either.Like I said WE , as in racers cant change the rules for Flexi Racing.Regards Brad.PS,If yuz all want a good set of rules for Flexis,check out the FNRS system from the U.S. Adopting somebody elses rules is the only system that seems to work out here.( eg Retro.).

[stoo23]

"James made this rule for a reason",... "If he wants to explain it its up to him",.. Hmmm,.. OK ??
"I know because I spoke to him about it when he did it",.. OK,.. Well,. DO tell !!,.. I'm sure the Security of the State will Not be in Danger by doing so !!,..

As this Did 'appear' to be an 'Issue' for Someone On the Night in Question, and Did Impact on Richard's Fine Performance (Points-Wise), I am sure the Rest of Us Would like to know
Personally, I would Not have Cared, even Had I noticed, as for myself, (being unaware of the Rule), I would Not have even mentioned or brought it to anyone's attention.

"I CANT believe somebody wasn't willing to throw Richard a set of tires to make him legal",.. Agreed !!,.. perhaps they Did and Richard didn't care?

"Show me a set of nationally unified rules for GT1 cars" Well, I Would, if the 'link' to them wasn't Broken
There Were GT-1 Rules for the Nat's and so there Must be a Copy floating around Somewhere !! Anyone happen to Have a copy ??

[brady]

Like I said James made the rule he can explain it and it probably would upset some people. Like I said there are no Nationly unified rules rules for GT1.The rules are made by the Track running the Nats and the next nats WILL probobly allow narrowing of tires.The link has nothing to do with it.And again read the rules before you race,whether there dubious or not and you wont have to travel for 6hrs for nothing.I wouldnt have efin cared either but somebody does thats why the efin things are scrutinered before the bloody race.BRAD.Maybe next round we could all lob there with S16D's in our flexis and bloody .760 tires on our Retros.Nobody would care!!! Probably

[Greg Erskine]

Let's not turn this into a storm in a tea cup.

The situation was handled properly on the night. Problem found, a few discussions, a solution found!

What we should be talking about is the race. I have never seen two guys as pumped at the end of a race as Troy and Richard were. It was good to see. Hey Richard, post your photos, you guys were so happy.

[brady]

Bullshit,That rule was put there for a reason.I might have gone about the wrong way but I dont appreciate being made out to be a complete f $#@wit when Im only half a one.Brad.

[stoo23]

"Let's not turn this into a storm in a tea cup" Agreed !!,..

I Honestly Hope No One thinks I have been trying to do so !!,.. Like I said, I am simply Intrigued and was (as suggested), also Unaware that a/the Rule Even Existed regarding Tyre Width !!

"The situation was handled properly on the night" YES,.. so it would seem.

"What we should be talking about is the race. I have never seen two guys as pumped at the end of a race as Troy and Richard were" YES !!,.. Please Note, through ALL of the 'Posts' I Have continually suggested Richard was/had done a fantastic Job of Driving !!

When you Look at the Lap totals for the brackets, Troy and Richard were usually circulating On the same Lap !! GREAT Stuff !!
Having had/done similar with Darryl at SSME a Few times,.. there is almost Nothing Better as far as racing goes, to be stonkering around Together, only Mere feet apart, trying to 'Eke' out an advantage,.. Anywhere !!,.. lol

Anyway,.. I also Don't want this to turn into some kind of argument over the Rules and I honestly Hope it hasn't come across as If I DO,.. Like I have kept saying, I was Also Unaware,.. as Simple as that.

YES Richard,.. Please Do 'Post' your Pics, if you have some !!

[GT1 Gunslinger]

Stoo23 i was joking mate sorry if it come across wrong

[Greg Erskine]

Sorry Brad, I wasn't directing my comments to anyone in particular.

[stoo23]

"Stoo23 i was joking mate sorry if it come across wrong"
Hey No Prob's at all,.. had thought I May have Upset yourself,.. LOL

"Also on the matter of going fast are the times that BEN punched out of my loaner to him,with the GT1,,,,FASTEST times on four of the six lanes" Yes !!,.. Pretty damn Impressive also !! and in a similar fashion, it should also be noted, that Casey did a similar thing on 4 x Lanes in the Retro Race !!
The SSME track seems to be a "Happy Hunting Ground" for Casey and Retro's !!,..

[GT1 Gunslinger]

The chassis that come first on that night was built by me as well.
I'll let the secret out ive built my own jig where i have 4 different cross squards a lot of time and effort gone into that jig

Even the body 100% squard.

At the end of the day where all friends let's keep it anical

[petrolhead]

Thanks Stoo great report
Another night of great close racing
Sorry i missed it
The tyre rule sounds like it made for an interesting night
I will ask James about that one next time i see him.
Also there is a body rule about rear wheel cutouts "not to be like Gp12 bodies"
I will need that one explained as well
Long LIVE the SRC great nights and great guys to race with
I would say that is why the numbers are good
Bring on the next and FINAL round for the year guys
Lets hope for that magic 17 plus in entries

Thanks
Wayne Webster

Sorry Neil

Wayne Walker

[stoo23]

Hey Hi Wayne & thanks

The 'Body' rule is rather simple and easy to understand as such.

It requires there to be Some Portions of the Rear of the Body (at the Top Extreme rear part) and Behind the Rear Wheels (Arches) to be Retained, Unlike the standard methodology in use with a 'Wing' car as such,.. See attached Pic (as an Example), for clarification

SAM_3695.jpg (147.86 KiB) Viewed 14527 times

Hope that helps
Cheers

[Mark Fox]

Hi Guys,

Good to see a bit of debate etc so I guess I will chuck my 2 cents worth in as well - no surprise there I guess.

OK when I started racing in the SRC Series my original racer was kindly supplied by James
(he even painted a Flouro Pink body with a Fox head for me) and I raced for at least a Year.
It was an absolute rocket and as it was his car I never actually looked at the nuts and bolts of it - just picked it up at the start of the race - had a ball - gave it back.

I foolishly decided the right thing to do was to buy my own car and get into it (foolishly because my car has never been as fast as James' Loaner) so I read the Rules.

DT is correct as to what the HSC GT-1 rules say - I must admit I was initially surprised by this Rule but hey - whatever - the rule is perfectly clear and there is no ambiguity at all.

Wheels & Tyres

Rears - any 3/32" commercially available, must run full width tyres (tyres may not be narrowed).

The rule is also counter intuitive as usually rules are crafted to keep people in line and are usually designed to limit behaviour such as - a minimum clearance, a minimum width etc. In the case of rear Wheels there is usually a Min Diameter and a Max Width.

The way the rear wheel rule is stated is such that if I manufactured rear wheels an Inch Wide and made them commercially available at $100.00 a pair - I could race with them (obviously the same goes for Any Width rear wheel under this scenario).

OK moving on to my experience starting to race my own GT1.

I found that Some rules are being routinely 'Bent' on the basis of 'Common Practice': for example:-

Chassis

1. Any commercially available 4" pressed steel Group 10, Flexi type chassis. Aluminium pans allowed.
2. No chassis modifications except for a motor and/or axle brace made from piano wire/brass tube or a Slick 7 EDM equivalent.
3. The front axle may be soldered in place at the pillow blocks and/or replaced with .062" piano wire.
4. Motor mounting tabs must be retained, oilite recess may be enlarged to allow improved gear mesh.
5. Front wheel retainers may be soldered in place.
6. Tape may be used to aid chassis performance.
7. "Shaker Tubes" may Not be used to mount the body.

Note Rule 2

2. No chassis modifications except for a motor and/or axle brace made from piano wire/brass tube or a Slick 7 EDM equivalent.

I soon discovered that everybody used a guide tongue strengthener to stop the bending in crashes.

WTF? I asked, to be met with the response that it was an 'Allowable transgression of the rules" or "everybody does it" etc.
HOWEVER it clearly violates Chassis Rule 2.

OK I hate the clips for the body mounting system but as it was mandated in the Rules I persevered and only in the past few months, discovered that Many racers are dispensing with them and installing 'Pin-Tubes' instead!

At the risk of repeating myself:-

WTF? I asked, to be met with the response that it was an 'Allowable transgression of the rules" or "everybody does it" etc.
HOWEVER it clearly violates Chassis Rule 2.

Further if Rule 2 were to be in force then Rule 7 is entirely redundant BUT its inclusion implies that 'Pin Tubes' may be allowed but Not 'Shaker Tubes'!

To reflect common practice and "allowed current rule transgressions" we should either change Rule 2 to read:-

No Chassis modifications except that:- a motor and/or axle brace made of piano wire.brass tubing or a Slick 7 EDM equivalent; JK or equivalent guide tongue strengthener; pin tubes in original body mount positions; may be used.

OR enforce it as the tyre rule was in Richard's case.

On this note I must praise Darryl for making the decision he did - he had No choice as the Rules clearly state the situation and once challenged there was NO option.

Did the narrow tyres give or was Richard seeking an advantage? - very unlikely in my opinion.

Hats off to Richard for displaying the temperament he did and exercising the philosophy of HAVING FUN.

Well Played Sir.

[brady]

Hi Mark.First up let me apologise to you Stoo for taking your comments the wrong way.I always value your opinion.Now Mark I dont care what happened the other night regarding the dq.What does piss me of a bit is people not knowing the rules then wanting them changed when they get pulled up.Most of us get pinged for something along the way then we fix it and carry on.The amount of people who said they didnt know about this rule surprised me.I mean hey c'mon read the rules guys.Now as far as changing rules go any track owner can stipulate any rule he likes for any class at Nats or any other comp.If he sees fit.To me that makes the rules for previous years Nats nul and void.And so any lesser comp using different rules does not give a unified set of rules for that class.AND us as racers can only change the rules by way of negotiation with the track owner.Is this correct or not.If somebody can correct me please do so.
I remind you of Waynes experiance of wanting put bearings in Group 12 wing motors a few years back.So I guess All Im trying to say is if you get pinged fix it.Dont winge about changing it because you didnt know about it.And there is no brace on my guide tounges because I use chassis thick enough to take a hit,not a piece of foil.Plz accept this exlpanation.Brad.