Australian Slot Car Racers Association

Cool !!!

Thanks for that Info about the Armatures Chadly, I was wondering What All the Noise was about.

I have heard of That style of Wind, but to Call it a Double as such, is somewhat Misleading.
I know many RC Guys have experimented with Various Winds like that, Often With differing 'Patterns' and Placement of the Winds.

To be Honest, I think I'd have to have a 'chat' with Hutcho, to try and Work out Just What advantage/disadvantage, If Any winding an arm that way would cause/provide,..I am Sure MANY 'Claims' have been made !!

As far as I am aware, even from the Original NCC Specs,..Group arms are 'described' as being "Single, Series wound", so there Could be arguments in Both directions over an arm made That way !!,..lol

Coaltrain,... Nice Looking Motors there Bud !!,.. Very Nice 'Array' !!

Please Note,..you Have Now gotten me into One of MY 'Pet' Subjects!!,..lol,..Just ask GaryJ, or Fox,..lol
May I say,..Up Front, I am Intrigued by this Modern 'Fascination' with Multi Segment Magnet Motors,..as IMHO there are Many reasons for their 'Adoption' en-masse, that May NOT Necessarily be Purely because of Performance ONLY.

That being said,..apart from the Obvious 'Proper and Correct' Period of coverage, provided by Magnets arrayed like that, it does,..Especially with the Segments You have assembled Provide a True Radial Arrangement,..very Nice.
True Radial arrays and Magnets Are actually a Rare thing !!, as you are probably also aware,..lol

As to Multi Segments, I am surprised people haven't 'Played' with the Placement and Sizes of the Individual Pieces of the Array!
In the Worl of Super High Efficiency Flight Motors, (as used for Launching in Hi Level World Model Sailplane Flying), there were some Truly Amazing Cobalt Motors some Years Back, That Used 'Spaced' Pieces of Varying Thickness and Section, within the Arc of Each Pole!!,..A concept that has always Intrigued me.
Sure They were Multi Pole armatures,..BUT,..as You Drag guys Might be Aware,..there is a Lot of Torque and Power to be Had,..For Free,..if One can Provide Very Controlled and Adequate Field return and You 'Look After' the 'Collapsing Field' as it were!!

If one Looks at the Moving 'Dynamic' Field Effects of a Rotating 3 pole armature, some Very Interesting 'Anomolies' as it were Occur, and it Could possibly be argued, that one Does Not Need Full Constant Thickness/Power/Section of Magnet Forming the 'Arc' of each Pole!!

Historically, Magnets used in the Motors for Slot cars, Weren't very Strong and were basically Copid from what was pretyy much Standard Industro Electrical Practice and Science,..But That was Before Super rare earth Magnets availability to the average slot car dude,..ROFL

I and perhaps many Others here would argue that perhaps in some classes the cars have been Over Magnetted !!!,..lol and with the Silly Era of Small Narrow magnet sections Hopefully Well behind us,..Non Chernobyl Motors are Once again Possible !!!,..lol

I Really think some Interesting 'Left Field' thinking could be applied here, with the Kind of Coercivity we have available to us these days !!!

When I find the Beautiful little File I have of the Armature Filed, I will Post it,..Be patient,..lol

As to My Motors,..OK,..just went and took some Pics of What is left.
All up, we had about 8 or 10 sets as I recall, we sold a Pair to Mike Thorby and to Gary Bell, in Fact I was Happy to sell them to Anyone who had the $80.00 the Set Cost me to Produce.
Mark and Myself, with Guidance and lengthy technical discussions with Hutcho and Some Lovely Can Cutting and Machining etc, (He actually did the 'Final CUT' to Separate Our Magnetic Chunk into Separate Pieces for 'Shaping'.

I Must mention here, the Help and Machining done by this strange chap I found down at Manly Vale, he made some RC stuff, but was seriously into Magnets and had some Fantastic Tooling.

He initially Machined the 'BAR' stock, into our Basic Ideal Shape, He managed to do Both the Inside and Outside Radii, whilst leaving it as One Long Hollow Piece!
It was perhaps arguably somewhat Wasteful, but he had a use for the remnants, so did it very cheap for me and the Finish was Exceptional !!
The Magnet guys were Impressed !!,..lol
I always thought the 'term' for the Machining, was 'Traperning', but I am obviously Wrong, as I just tried looking that word up,..ROFL

We had about 3 or 4 'Variants', with Thickness/Length behind the centre and Both Widening and Narrowing Arcs of the magnet as it wrapped around the arm,..the Photos will help in understanding what I mean.

My favourite Motor, which Had Extreme Pole Coverage,..the gap between the Tops of Each magnet being Very Close!,..NO Other Motors have Ever had the Field Coverage these Magnets provided!! With the radial orientation, the Motors were as Smooth as Silk in Commutation,..Just as we had surmised !!
So Basically we had Short and Thick in the centre, with Widening /Length, towards the Tips and Long and fat in the centre and Narrowing at the Tips.
Along with Varying Tip Edge Shapes and radii.
As the Magnets seemed to really Upset a certain Growing faction at the time who In My Opinion evebntually Destroyed Group 20's as they were, They were Banned, by the association, when they Ruined the Group 20 class as i had been know and went to ceramics, and Oilites!,..Sigh,.."Bastards,..You Killed Group 20 !!",..

Anyway,..because they ended up having a shorter use by date than I had envisaged, we didn't continue with the 'Science' of it as such,..as Our Initial 'beliefs' were Confirmed,..and Then Some !!1,..lol

Cheers


We did have a Few of them!,..lol


When we decided to do the Magnets, This was what Everyone Else was running !!


Not Much Magnet Eh?,..Nice Cans though. A magnetically Sensible Design as such.


This is a a Standard Style of Cut, of Our Magnets, in a Standard Can.


And These, are Where we Went !!,..lol












And Here is Just One Example of One of the Shapes,..it Just Happened to Be Lose.




And if You Look VERY Carefully,..you May Notice Another Interesting AND Effective arrangement, with the Shape !!,..

Very interesting stoo can't wait to see the magnetic field around a armature.
Chadly my next mission will be to chase down Peter Mase's .398

Damn,..I can't seem to find that File.
I thought I had Saved it,..I might Yet find it.

It was from a site on the web and was Not relating to slot cars, but showed the actual Field Movement and Collapsing field in a Unique way, that related More to The Real World effects, than just the Pure Science of it,..lol

If I can remember what I searched for to find it,..lol, I'll post it here,..I thought I sent it to GaryJ, but can't see that in my emails to him,..Oh well,...

Very nice Stoo, some ideas i have dreamed of too.
I had thoughts of shaping the tips, curving them longitudinally, but i spose that could severely effect the flux pattern if not done properly.

Coaltrain the track that Miyagi ran that .398 on for Pete is currently in Miyagi's backyard. He has some idea's for the track but i cant see it lasting too long without a stainless steel surface or something. The surface started bubbling and cracking when Craig had it semi outdoors. I think Miyagi wants to put it under a tree!

yeah if Peter can stop traveling the globe Im sure it will get set up somewhere appropriate.
so far with the cars I brought back from Melbourne without doing anything to them these
are as close as i have gotten to date


It shouldn't take to long I should get it next outing

My best is .454 on 1000ft. I don't really have the money to go really fast in AA. Craig's quad motor that did the .452 dropped half a segment, so i glued the broken peice back in, honing it by hand with a dremmel. It ran .414 over the 1000.
The Xtreme strip now at Miyagi's place needs a total rebuild. Looking down the strip it was starting to droop in parts and the cracks at joins had opened up big time.

We went .410 on the full Xtreme 1/4mile..........with a motor-less car. T/S was only about 30mph. We hooked about 100 rubber bands together and stretch it out almost the full length of the track, hooking one end over the motorless car. We put it in stage, set off the timing system and let it go. Amazing that it stayed in the slot!

How did it stop??


In a few bits?

Hi Stoo,

Does the rust make the motors go faster??

Geoff

You Old Bugger !!

No!,..But I find the way the Oxidised particles arrange themselves gives a good indication of Flux Flow !!!,..

Yeah,..a Bit slack of me I guess,..but Hey,..atleast I 'Saved' this stuff from over 20 Years Ago,..Even a couple of Fox's Old Chassis !!



Found this Old Pic, from 1989, of what was Often the Group 20 Podiums of that Era!!,... Perhaps Not Always,..but Often Enough !!
PIC;
(Obviously My Car, Mike Thorby's and Mark Fox's) All Piano Wire Cars, built by each of Us !! Whilst Mike Did run our magnets, he didn't run the Large 'Profiles' that Fox and I were running, His were slightly Larger than the Group 15 style magnets everyone else was running.

It Really Was a FUN Era of Racing,..there were some Great drivers and as the class had been pretty Stable Equipment and Rules wise for some Years, the Racing was Fantastic, We usually ran Group 27's on the same day, so invariably, had a Great group of 'Regulars',..it Was a Popular Class, and Very 'Affordable',..although Some thought Not !!

It was basically Originally 'C' Cans Way back and Standard group 20 arms, Ball bearings Everywhere.
When we came Back, the Koford feather cans had become 'the Norm', but basically, effectively the same.

Everyone basically just ran 'Off the Shelf' Mura arms and, to be honest, they were Really VERY Good!! As Many here will attest I'm Sure, there were Few 'Duds' as such,..but ofcourse one Could always Find the odd 'Pearler' !!,..

Damn SHAME !!,..that there Isn't Still a 'Wing Car' Class Like this anymore,..that Allows Scratch-Built Chassis and Some 'Personal' Creativity.
Since My Youth, it had Always been THE Most Popular Class.

Like many of the Old Pro racers in the States,..it is Why WE race Retro's !!,.. Cheers

these days "scratch building" requires you to be handy on autocad and have a good lazer cutter!
scratch built wire chassis' are still legal in wing car classes, but dont expect to run near the front of the pack!

Well,..actually NO,..If you Re Read the Rules,..Sure one Could run a Piano Wire chassis in Opens OR 27's,..but I doubt I would,..

It is in the Lower classes, you know,..the 'Appropriate' classes,..Like Wing 12's and Int' 15's,..where previously,..the concept of running a Steel.Aluminium. etc chassis, was NOT allowed in the Rules,..arguably,..the way it Should Have Stayed !!

You Know,..there were a damn Lot of VERY Effective and Australian National Championship Winning cars, that Were designed without Autocad and were Actually 'Hand Cut' chassis !!

It IS What WE HAD to do in days Gone By,..in fact I Still have a Number of Camen 'Blue Spring Steel' Plates, for Just That purpose !!!

I ran a wire chassis (borowed.....sp) in GP 12 wing the other year at the nats.
I've seen many run wire chassis' in GP 15.